Roger, Robert,
Yes, i agree with you that homogeneity is not a desirable objective, for
sure. For me was fresh air to participate in a confernece with very
different disciplines and with lots of different trends to perform the
talks. But when many people from different disciplines came together, they
are mediated by their "languaje", "mode", which is adapted from its own
discipline. And this could make some missunderstandings by itself. The
solution would be not to homogeneizate all the talks with the same form,
but may be to understand why has this form/mode/use of languaje. For
example:
One participant, who cames from Phylosophy, read a paper. I never seen this
in my field (Physics). However, i understood that, even this would be an
error in physics, this is the perfect talk for phylosopy. Why?, because in
phylosophy you are presenting a pure thinking (we can use the music "mode"
metaphore as "unpluged thinking!!"), and the words are the tools for the
thinking, so each word, and no other, must be selected by their precise
meaning. In science i can use many words, the important thing is the data
and the experiment, but i can capture it with many different words.
However, as reading is a difficult to follow technique, for the audience,
there are different techniques for reading and to involucrate to the
audience. This participant selects an special voice, very charm, and
delicate. This voice was so seductive, that helps a lot to get in touch
with the thinking. However, i can not imaging this kind of talk in a, for
example, Optics and Sensors Devices conference. Which is not bad, is only
different by their different needs.
Another thing. In the conference, here yes, like all the conferences, were
some problems with the timing. Michele Emmer said that in a political
context for the most important speachs it is used only 5 min. This is, for
me, another example for the different needs for different
modes/disciplines/subjetcs. I think 5 mins would be good for explicit
political contexts, because it is needed clear sentences and very well
known discurses. However, in a more scientific escenacrio may be it is
needed more time to present a discurse with meanings. May be it is needed
some time to offer a detailed description, and a "route" for the thinking.
So even Time would be a parameter that could define the signs and the needs
for the discipline of the talk.
May be to understand these differences could act as a vehicle to understand
some aspects of the different disciplines, but not in a way to make it
homogeneos, but to understand between us, and so, exchange and collaborate.
2013/12/25 roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu>
> guillermo , robert
>
> am going to pick up on your exchange on 'modes of discourse"- as guillermo
> pointed out in the art science and city conference in Bilbao
> http://www.artsciencecity.com/?lang=en
> there were talks from architects, artists, urbanists, humanists and
> scientists- and indeed
> their way of developing and presenting their arguments varied- various
> 'discourses"
>
> i have just been asked by judy malloy to develop an article on how the
> leonardo
> community of practice developed the use of digital and on line media -
> particularly
> before the web- in our case the disruptive technology was desk top
> publishing
> which we started using in the mid 1980s but then with ray lauzzana in
> 1987/8
> started on line discussion/news groups on arpanet etc before
> internet-- and now 99% of our
> audience is on line and never sees our print products
>
> judy malloy is teaching a course at princeton on Social Media:
> History, Poetics, and Practice
>
>
> http://registrar.princeton.edu/course-offerings/course_details.xml?courseid=012458&term=1142
>
> the art and technology community because they were creating art using
> digital media
> also develop new modes of on line discourse to present and discuss
> their work-this
> happened much later in the humanities or urban studies- i think for
> example of
> galloway and rabinowicz electronic cafe
>
> http://18thstreet.org/public-programs/past-exhibitions-events/collaboration-labs/kit-galloway-sherrie-rabinowitz-electronic-cafe-international
> and in 1991 leonardo published art and interactive telecommunications
> edited by carl loeffler and roy ascott
> which documented much of the work in the 1980s
>
> the new media curating list
> https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A0=new-media-curating
> just finished a really interesting discussion around the curating
> issues and documenting the work
> in the 1970s and 1980s that were pre web- but also the early web art
>
> things are accelerating again now with the development of various
> forms of 'grey literature'- but also
> open access publishing- and the ways that both artists present and
> document their work is evolving
> rapidly- we forget that the classic format of the scientific paper is
> very recent- and that artists writing about
> their own work ( which leonardo journal championed) is a relatively
> recent development in the art world
>
> so i think guillermo makes a good point that in these cross
> disciplinary conferences like art
> science and the city- we did see very different styles of arguing and
> presenting, differing
> rhetorical approaches from artists, urban planners, humanits,
> historians, scientists- that this
> diversity of approaches is valuable in itself as robert thill pointed
> out we should not be seeking
> to make modes of thought-and presentation- homogeneous
>
> roger malina
>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 5:05 PM, robert thill <robert.thill@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Roger,
> >
> >
> > Guillermo,
> >
> > Your interpretation of modes of communication has been lampooned by
> > many. However, I think it is very helpful to hear your perception of
> > it when it is mixed at one conference. To me, the idea of
> > communication becoming "explicit discourse" is more interesting than
> > it becoming homogenous.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Robert Thill
> >
> >
> >
>
> >>
> >> 2013/12/18 ciencia pirata <piratas.de.la.ciencia@gmail.com>
> >>
> >>> Roger,
> >>>
> >>> This is a great idea. I have some minimal comments:
> >>>
> >>> 1) It was amazing that this was the first conference for me where the
> >>> communication by itself was transdisciplinary. I mean, the own
> >>> lectures/talks uses different communication skils and techniques just
> >>> because different disciplines have different languajes and signs.
> >>> (Phylosophy = reading with voice entonation; Ciencie = visual schemes
> >>> with
> >>> very direct languaje; Arts: More interactive talks with videos). For
> me,
> >>> at
> >>> the firs sight, i understood as "errors", beacuse i´m used to see only
> >>> one
> >>> tipe of talk, but i understanded that each discipline have its own
> tools,
> >>> and just for this needs different communication strategies. So, in
> >>> conclusion, this conference, for me, was mediated by another
> discipline,
> >>> which is communication. This is obvious, but if we push it into
> explicit
> >>> discurse i think we can stablish more rigorous and powerfull exchanges.
> >>>
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Let´s follow,
> >>>
> >>> Guillermo.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> 2013/12/17 roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu>
> >>>
> >>> > guillermo
> >>> >
> >>> > it was great to see you and other yasminers at the
> >>> > first Art Science and the City conference
> >>> >
> >>> > http://www.artsciencecity.com/?lang=en
> >>> >
> >>> > that was held last week in Bilbao.
> >>> >
> >>> > As i understand it Valencia may host the second conference
> >>> > in two years.
> >>> >
> >>> > I thought it might be interesting if we shared our impressions
> >>> > and reactions to the conference ? any particular things stand out /
> >>> >
> >>> > For me - one of the interests of the conference was that it was
> >>> > dominated
> >>> > by the architects and urban studies professionals and activists- i
> dont
> >>> > often
> >>> > interact with those professions
> >>> >
> >>> > I expected more discussion of the on line world as a public space and
> >>> > what the architecture and design issues are- most studies of on line
> >>> > behaviour
> >>> > show that we carry over on line our habits and practices from the
> >>> > physical world-
> >>> > but maybe that there is even more segregation- homophily - on line
> >>> > that in physical
> >>> > spaces
> >>> >
> >>> > several papers of course discussed how computer aided design has
> become
> >>> > a
> >>> > source of new ideas in architecture- particularly the work of
> unstudio
> >>> > http://www.unstudio.com/
> >>> > where caroline bos presented their work
> >>> > their work in knowldge sharing is interesting and it connected
> >>> > to my own talk where i talked about open observatories and open data
> >>> >
> >>> > roger malina
> >>> >
> >>> > KNOWLEDGE SHARING IN KNOWLEDGE PLATFORMS
> >>> >
> >>> > Since the founding of the practice, UNStudio has been developing
> >>> > design knowledge as a result of combining the designing and building
> >>> > of projects with an active participation in architectural theory. In
> >>> > 2008, following a continued interest in geometry, digital production,
> >>> > material effects and attainable design solutions, this communal
> >>> > knowledge led to the introduction of knowledge platforms to the
> >>> > studio.
> >>> > Whilst the primary objective of our project teams is to deliver the
> >>> > 'result' of architectural thinking (buildings, plans, designs), the
> >>> > objective of the knowledge platforms is to distill knowledge from
> >>> > within the practice of architecture in order to propel design
> thinking
> >>> > and innovation.
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> >>> > From: Guillermo Muñoz <m.m.guillermo@gmail.com>
> >>> > Date: Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 4:26 PM
> >>> > Subject: [Yasmin: This week Yasmin moderator
> >>> > To: YASMIN ANNOUNCEMENTS <Yasmin_announcements@estia.media.uoa.gr>
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > Dear Yasminers,
> >>> >
> >>> > I´m happy to be your Yasmin moderator along this week.
> >>> >
> >>> > I would like to offer to all new subscribers to present themselves
> and
> >>> > their related work to the art/sci context.
> >>> >
> >>> > I woud be happy to answer any doubt or try to solve any problem along
> >>> > the
> >>> > following week.
> >>> >
> >>> > Finally i just want to remeber to the list that some of us meet last
> >>> > week
> >>> > at Bilbao in the Art, Science and City congres, and was a delightly
> >>> > time
> >>> to
> >>> > meet and discuss some of the ideas concerning the advantages and
> >>> > difficulties to work in this networked area. We get a really
> motivated,
> >>> > inspirational and charm session and talks.
> >>> >
> >>> > All the best from Valencia and best whishes for the following
> hollydays
> >>> > days,
> >>> >
> >>> > Guillermo Muñoz.
> >>> > _______________________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > _______________________________________________
> >>> > Yasmin_discussions mailing list
> >>> > Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
> >>> > http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
> >>> >
> >>> > Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
> >>> >
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Clarissa Ribeiro
> >> www.clarissaribeiro.com
> >> UCLA Art|Sci Fulbright Post-doctoral Research Scholar
> >> art.sci.ucla.edu <http://artsci.ucla.edu/>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Yasmin_discussions mailing list
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> >
> > _______________________________________________
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>
> --
> Roger F Malina
> Is in California right now
> please contact me by email but
> for very very urgent things phone/text me me
> 1-510-853-2007
> blog: malina.diatrope.com
>
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