Sunday, April 19, 2015

[Yasmin_discussions] Why do Science Films often have such terrible use of music or sound

Yasminers, Guillermo speaking.

I have some comments:

1) First of all, i would like to resume a couple of projects that use this
sonification of light. The examples are listed by Eva Alloza, from our
Piratas de la Ciencia group.

- The enlightenment, from quiet ensemble:

http://www.quietensemble.com/the_enlightenment_eng.html

- Neurospace (audio 3D), by Timothy Schmele. Sonification from fMRI images.

http://phonos.upf.edu/node/750?language=en

- Here just a compilation of works,

http://datasonification.tumblr.com/?soc_src=mail&soc_trk=ma

2) I pick a sentence from Richard´s post: "Will we soon be able to sense
and comprehend a macro-to-micro continuum (the new analog)?"

As a nanotechnology researcher i think this sentence has strong
implications. Nanodevices are in the heart of the sensing mechanism,
including our biological senses. May be, just a change in vocabulary, i
would like to change a little bit to "from atom to macro continuum", in the
sense that nanoscaled effects, could link both ranges.

I´m very interested on this topic, an this would be my research work on the
next Scientific Delirum Madness. Periodic table is just a representation
that connects atomic characteristics (number of electrons, protons, ...)
with macroscopic material properties (metals, semiconductors, noble gases,
...). It is just fascinating this representation. May be we can
understanding as a XIX century representation. Our idea is that nanoscaled
nanomaterial, by their specific properties, needs an alternative
representation. In words of Javier Garcia: "Nanotechnoilogy adds a third
dimension to the periodic table" (
http://metode.cat/en/Metode-TV/Entrevista-a-Javier-Garcia). So, this new
dimension needs new representations, and as nanotechnology is a nowadays
science, we needs nowadays ways to represent. But this ways needs to know
the characteristics of nanoparticles and their link to the macroscopic
material responses. I guess this representation must contain a very rich
kind of information, as the conventional periodic table has it.I think this
is ver hard work, and at the same time very deep science topic. In science
new representations gives the possibility to build new measurement set-up.
In fact, new set-up is kind of new sense (i like your three division
categories Roger!). So, new sense is new way to know, so understand, so,
science. So, there is an strong and deep link between representing to
understanding. So, this is an answer to the question: what can do art for
science? = do best and deep science.

3) However, i have some discrepancy in one concept. I agreed that today new
ways of representation contains powerfull "visions", but i think old
fashion ways must be listened too. I think old is a world that have many
implications. Greek philosophy is old, but we can study it with today
"eyes" (through hermeneutic processes), and this is a kind of "new"
discourses (this is obvious). And just the contrary can happen as well (new
technologies just to do the same things). I like a lot the XIX century
Wheatstone Kaleidophone, which is a way to translate sound vibrations into
light patterns. XIX century is full of very rich experiments, which in our
today eyes could give us enormous feedback. I leave here an example of
converting sound into visual patterns which comes from this old way of
representation, but for me contains fascinating power. However, at the same
time, it contains the same error than the sun video. There are two
versions, first one is just the experiment, with the amazing sound of
vibration, which in fact is totally related to the visual pattern (it can
help us to visualize electron Wavefunction in Quantum dots, or light
propagating modes in fiber optics, or many more !!). The second one is just
the same video, but with the sound from scientist taste (this time even
worse!!). I leave you both versions:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yaqUI4b974

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvJAgrUBF4w

Independent if this is XIX century example of visualization/representation,
our "reading" could be "old" or "new". Second video, with the scientist
election for music destroys the beauty of the vibrational original sound.
At least, we have the opportunity to listen both versions.

4) Finally, i would like to send another example of science communication
of light, which is, in my opinion, much much better, from BBBC Barcelona:

http://newsletter.cccb.org//newsletters-portlet/ViewHtmlServlet/viewEmails?newsletterId=10944&languageId=ca_ES&dispersionId=7486336322462883372238743483377637664388223262644328676838273236663243433322233763746247688367337383

Best,

Guillermo.
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Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Trans-Sensuality

Thanks Richard
"The information/energy ecosystem is rich and complex. Our evolutionary
future,
is leading us to be more sensate and in-tune, with and without tools, for
ultimate survival.
This is our nature. "
A realtime terrain "symphony" and sonifications from treed forest
environments.
leif
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Saturday, April 18, 2015

[Yasmin_discussions] Why do Science Films often have such terrible use of music or sound

Roger, i totally agreed. To be on the present needs action, it is not just
a matter of passing time. There are large amount of technology everywhere,
it is our responsibility to use it. But for sure, we need present minds as
well !!,

I leave here a link to the sonification of the ATLAS detector data which
Jose Manuel tell us some posts before. This is very interesting !!

https://lhcsound.wordpress.com/

https://lhcsound.wordpress.com/sonification-of-di-photon-channel-part-2/

Guillermo.
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Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Trans-Sensuality

We are becoming trans-sensuals.

All living things are tuning organisms, having evolved
to narrowly but deeply sense in particular EM spectral ranges.

As though we are handicapped, our new sensing and communication
technologies are sensory aids, allowing us to sense and communicate
across and in a full range of tunable wavelengths and frequencies.
This complexly rich, life-endowing flow and flux of energy and information
surrounds and permeates us and all other things, in ways we are
just beginning to tune into. This is more than data, which is the by-product
of digital sampling and thinking (discrete bits). But digital sensing and
processing are interim stages of development. Will we soon be able to sense
and comprehend a macro-to-micro continuum (the new analog)?

Creatively exploring this sensory spectrum over the past 45 years, I have
encountered some individuals with synaesthetic abilities, able to 'see' slightly beyond
the visible range, into the near IR or UV window, or have other extended sensory ranges.
Playing with researchers at Smith Kettlewell Institute in San Francisco in the mid-70s,
allowed for creative works with 'blind' performers, who with the aid of sensory aids,
used ultrasonic echolocation devices to spatially navigate through complex spaces,
translating sound variations into spatial sensory modes. B&W video cameras
would activate a low-res matrix pin-screen, worn on the back or on a finger-tip or
in the palm, so that a non-sighted person could sense visual-space imagery
as a tactile display. My personal experience was that it took very little time
and training (less than one hour) for our brains to make the shift and connection
to process this trans-sensual information, into navigational skills.

This opens up the realm of trans-sensory language development and understanding.
We can do this 'naturally', with our limited senses, and we will continue to tune into,
extend and explore our information-rich environment with new technologies,
which will also evolve to be more sophisticated and semi-organic sensory aids.

The information/energy ecosystem is rich and complex. Our evolutionary future,
is leading us to be more sensate and in-tune, with and without tools, for ultimate survival.
This is our nature.

Richard


On Apr 18, 2015, at 10:18 AM, roger malina wrote:

> guillermo
>
> you are absolutely right the david eagleman
> example
>
> http://www.ted.com/talks/david_eagleman_can_we_create_new_senses_for_humans
>
> is not a 'new sense' but an 'extended' sense where he 'translates' data into
> a form where human sense of touch is activated
>
> i usually talk about three categories
> - augmented senses when you increase the sensitivity of a sense ( eg
> optical microscope)
> - extended sense - eg when you extend the sense of vision to the IR or X ray
> - New sense when you create a situation where the body can sense forms
> of energy that
> it is not build to detect ( eg gravity waves, cosmic rays )
>
> in the case of new senses you can either translate them into a form an
> existing sense
> can detect as eagleman does- or as you point out you could create a
> new input directly into the brain
> which is also what david eaglement talks about
>
> anyway - i often argue we are now in a 'data culture' where we make decisions
> as much from direct sensory inputs to the real world as from
> interfaces to large data
> sets about the real world
>
> but we are still behaving like 19C scientists trying to visualise data
> using techniques
> that were developed in an era when we were not deluged with data ( dan boorstin
> calls this an epistemelogical inverstion- going from meaning rich and data poor
> to data rich and meaning poor)
>
> the video of the sun that you showed that started this discussion
>
> http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/sdo/videos/index.html
>
> is using sound in a way that is irrelevant to understanding the amazing
> images of the sun and fails to take advantage of the brain's multi modal
> perception and cognition
>
> and in fact those images use augmented and extended senses methodologies
> but the science film is in a nineteenth century way of thinking
>
> roger malina
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Guillermo Muñoz <m.m.guillermo@gmail.com>
> Date: Sat, Apr 18, 2015 at 9:31 AM
> Subject: [Yasmin_discussions] Why do Science Films often have such
> terrible use of music or sound
> To: YASMIN DISCUSSIONS <yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr>
>
>
> Wow, this TED talk is amazing ¡¡ But, in reality these examples are not new
> senses, no?, these are kind of translations, and used by brain plasticity
> to have alternative feeling experiences. But the connection is made by
> conventional senses (visual, tactile, sound, smell or taste). May be some
> detector directly conected to brain driving electrical discharges could be
> as new sense, no?
>
> In another hand, this is a very famous example: the artist Neil Harbisoon
> uses an extension of senses to listen colors. I leave this TED talk:
>
> http://www.ted.com/talks/neil_harbisson_i_listen_to_color?language=es
>
> Best,
>
> Guillermo
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> --
> Roger F Malina
> is in texas
> 1-510-853-2007
>
> _______________________________________________
> Yasmin_discussions mailing list
> Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
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>
> Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
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---------------------------------------------------------
Richard Lowenberg, Executive Director
1st-Mile Institute www.1st-mile.org
P. O. Box 8001, Santa Fe, NM 87504
505-603-5200 rl@1st-mile.org
---------------------------------------------------------






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[Yasmin_discussions] Fwd: Why do Science Films often have such terrible use of music or sound

guillermo

you are absolutely right the david eagleman
example

http://www.ted.com/talks/david_eagleman_can_we_create_new_senses_for_humans

is not a 'new sense' but an 'extended' sense where he 'translates' data into
a form where human sense of touch is activated

i usually talk about three categories
- augmented senses when you increase the sensitivity of a sense ( eg
optical microscope)
- extended sense - eg when you extend the sense of vision to the IR or X ray
- New sense when you create a situation where the body can sense forms
of energy that
it is not build to detect ( eg gravity waves, cosmic rays )

in the case of new senses you can either translate them into a form an
existing sense
can detect as eagleman does- or as you point out you could create a
new input directly into the brain
which is also what david eaglement talks about

anyway - i often argue we are now in a 'data culture' where we make decisions
as much from direct sensory inputs to the real world as from
interfaces to large data
sets about the real world

but we are still behaving like 19C scientists trying to visualise data
using techniques
that were developed in an era when we were not deluged with data ( dan boorstin
calls this an epistemelogical inverstion- going from meaning rich and data poor
to data rich and meaning poor)

the video of the sun that you showed that started this discussion

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/sdo/videos/index.html

is using sound in a way that is irrelevant to understanding the amazing
images of the sun and fails to take advantage of the brain's multi modal
perception and cognition

and in fact those images use augmented and extended senses methodologies
but the science film is in a nineteenth century way of thinking

roger malina

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Guillermo Muñoz <m.m.guillermo@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, Apr 18, 2015 at 9:31 AM
Subject: [Yasmin_discussions] Why do Science Films often have such
terrible use of music or sound
To: YASMIN DISCUSSIONS <yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr>


Wow, this TED talk is amazing ¡¡ But, in reality these examples are not new
senses, no?, these are kind of translations, and used by brain plasticity
to have alternative feeling experiences. But the connection is made by
conventional senses (visual, tactile, sound, smell or taste). May be some
detector directly conected to brain driving electrical discharges could be
as new sense, no?

In another hand, this is a very famous example: the artist Neil Harbisoon
uses an extension of senses to listen colors. I leave this TED talk:

http://www.ted.com/talks/neil_harbisson_i_listen_to_color?language=es

Best,

Guillermo
_______________________________________________


--
Roger F Malina
is in texas
1-510-853-2007

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[Yasmin_discussions] Why do Science Films often have such terrible use of music or sound

Wow, this TED talk is amazing ¡¡ But, in reality these examples are not new
senses, no?, these are kind of translations, and used by brain plasticity
to have alternative feeling experiences. But the connection is made by
conventional senses (visual, tactile, sound, smell or taste). May be some
detector directly conected to brain driving electrical discharges could be
as new sense, no?

In another hand, this is a very famous example: the artist Neil Harbisoon
uses an extension of senses to listen colors. I leave this TED talk:

http://www.ted.com/talks/neil_harbisson_i_listen_to_color?language=es

Best,

Guillermo
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[Yasmin_discussions] Why do Science Films often have such terrible use of music or sound

Ale

thanks for point out the work of David Eagleman which is
an amazing example of perceptual training- which allows
a person to 'feel' a data stream

David Eagleman: Can we create new senses for humans?

http://www.ted.com/talks/david_eagleman_can_we_create_new_senses_for_humans

in his case he has build a vest with mechanical stimuli and as the
data is fed into
the vest the human learns to detect patterns in the distrubution of stimuli on
their back- he talks of deaf people being able to 'feel' the applause
of spectators-
or even of the overall feeling of the stock market data as touch
patterns on their back

he mentions also taking sentiment analysis of twitter feeds into
sensory physical
feeling-this makes me think of roy ascott and his discussions of planetary
consciousness- one could imagine wearing a vest whcih would allow you
to 'sense' the emotions of people in a different location

my example of sonification data is indeed only one example where there
are many new possible modes of helping us find and understand patterns
in large data sets- when as eagleman points out the senses that humans
have are an accident of evolution- immersive data is a new sensory
situation and our visual coortex is badly designed for the kinds of
pattern finding we now need to do- we have great edge detectors
but lousy complex network structure detectors !

thanks for pointing the work of eagleman out !

i see from your web site: http://www.aledelapuente.org/

that you co directed the fantastic Gravedad de los Asuntos
which took nine mexican artists into zero gravity


La Gravedad de los Asuntos (The Gravity of Issues), a project
involving nine artists and scientists that will explore concepts of
gravity and develop work to be realized in Gravity Zero Parabolic
Flights. I co-directed this project with Nahum Mantra and Juan José
Díaz Infante, in collaboration with the Laboratorio Arte Alameda and
the National Institute of Nuclear Science UNAM, among other
institutions.

gravity is another example of a sense that is an accident of evolution
on our planet- and indeed as people go into
zero gravity they have to go through intensive perceptual training to
re calibrate their systems that have been totally designed
only to work well in one gravity

anyway- i suspect we will consider the crude use of music in science
films today as very primitive
a few hundred years from now when we have figured out how to do full
multi modal immersion in data !

roger malina

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Ale de la Puente <delapuente.ale@gmail.com>

...have you watch this?

http://www.ted.com/talks/david_eagleman_can_we_create_new_senses_for_humans

regards!!!
Ale

On Sat, Apr 18, 2015 at 4:14 AM, roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu> wrote:

> yasminers
>
> I thought i would inject a different line of discussion about the role
> of sound or music accompanying science communications films
>
> here is an extreme example of music composed that actually
> "plays' the data
>
> What would LHC sound like if it was a heavy metal band
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXEnDM3hydM
>
> it is described as higgs boson sonification
>
> but more seriously- in scientific data analysis visualisation is a dominant
> mode of presentation and the use of other modes of perception rarely used-
> now however with many scientists putting their data into game engines-many
> new modes of navigation through data are possible- including using sound
> as a perceptual aid or addition that helps scientists understand/look for
> patterns in their data- there is a growing community of researchers
> working on
> data sonification in general
>
> my colleague scot gresham lancaster is the producer of the sound and data
> channel on Creative Disturbance art-science podcast platform:
>
> http://creativedisturbance.org/channel/sound-data/
>
> where he discusses with various experts aspects of data and sound
>
> some of the motivation for all this is tied to what Eleanor Gibson termed
> "perceptual learning"
>
>
> http://psych.nyu.edu/adolph/publications/AdolphKretch-inpress-GibsonTheory.pdf
>
> On Gibson's (1969) account, perceptual learning entails an increased
> ability to extract relevant
> information from a stimulus array as the result of experience. The
> traditional view of perceptual
> learning, dating back to Bishop Berkeley in the 1700s, is that animals
> must learn to perceive; the
> information at sensory receptors is impoverished and meaningless and
> thus a complete percept
> requires learning. In Gibson's view, the information at receptors is
> sufficient to support complete
> percepts from the start, and thus animals needn't learn to perceive;
> rather, they perceive to learn
> (E. J. Gibson, 1989, July). Perceptual learning is the key to
> knowledge and where it all begins
>
>
> http://psych.nyu.edu/adolph/publications/AdolphKretch-inpress-GibsonTheory.pdf
>
> the fact is that in every day cognition/perception we 'toggle' between
> sensory modes
> seamlessly as the best way to "extract information from a stimulus array"-
> yes
> in scientific communication we use music or sound as an accompaniment
> rather
> than as a perceptual learning tool
>
> it seems to me this is a growing trend in scientific communication
>
> does anyone have other examples of project that 'play the data ' ?
>
>
--
...
*Ale de la Puente*

www.aledelapuente.org

skype: aledelapuente
T: + 52 55 55 54 0895
M: + 52 1 55 54 34 8548
_
1-510-853-2007

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