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THIS IS THE YASMIN-DISCUSSIONS DIGEST
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Science for the People: article on recent Zapatista
science/awareness conference (YASMIN DISCUSSIONS)
2. science for the people discussion: redesigning science itself
(YASMIN DISCUSSIONS)
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Message: 1
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2018 04:22:40 -0500
From: YASMIN DISCUSSIONS <yasmin_discussions@ntlab.gr>
To: yasmin_discussions@ntlab.gr
Subject: Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Science for the People: article on
recent Zapatista science/awareness conference
Message-ID:
<mailman.9.1519936984.47506.yasmin_discussions_ntlab.gr@ntlab.gr>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
HI everyone; John here.
Yes, I was invited in both 2016 and 2017 to the ConCiencias conferences of the Zapatistas. As in so many other arenas the Zapatista movement is developing a unique approach to science. For me it is most heartening to see them rejecting all forms of pseudosciences, claiming that formal science must be part of the new world as much as music and art. They do not seem to have a crude utilitarian attitude, which I regard as a positive attribute. They specifically asked me to talk about ecology as part of the arsenal to discover and widen the ?cracks in the wall of capitalism.? I presented a couple of scenarios in which the science of ecology at its foundation creates such cracks (at least in my opinion) at least with regard to agroecosystems. It was an inspirational experience both times (the conference, not my talks). Looking forward to following up with some sort of workshops or short courses, or whatever they come up with. They are not the kind of group that welcomes ANY contribution from outside. They want to be in charge of defining their own needs, which is why they have been getting stronger ever since the first uprising in 1994.
cheers,
John
> On Feb 27, 2018, at 3:04 PM, YASMIN DISCUSSIONS <yasmin_discussions@ntlab.gr> wrote:
>
> This fascinating article about the Dec 2017 Las ConCiencias conference ? "a call for scientists to organize, to create new organizational systems for aiding grassroots struggles? ? gets to the heart of issues around how to create a science that is truly by and for the people:
>
> "The Zapatistas demand that science be reimagined by both scientists and the grassroots together as a technique of resistance. Decolonizing science requires scientists to organize in their own communities, and to deconstruct how their own research methodologies and epistemologies have been employed as tools of colonialism and neocolonialism. Such a process of decolonization also demands scientists become engaged allies, co-conspirators, and accomplices who can share methodological and theoretical insights with grassroots movements about how to build a new vision of science within the cracks of capital?s wall.?
>
> https://towardfreedom.com/archives/americas/cracks-in-the-wall-of-capitalism-the-zapatistas-and-the-struggle-to-decolonize-science/
>
> John Vandermeer, one of this discussion's invited respondents, attended this conference (pictured in article). Would be very interested to hear thoughts from John, or others engaged/interested in such initiatives...
>
> Alyce
> alycesantoro.com <http://www.alycesantoro.com/>
> @alyceobvious <http://www.twitter.com/alyceobvious>
>
>
>
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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2018 17:05:40 -0600
From: YASMIN DISCUSSIONS <yasmin_discussions@ntlab.gr>
To: yasmin_discussions@ntlab.gr
Subject: [Yasmin_discussions] science for the people discussion:
redesigning science itself
Message-ID:
<mailman.12.1519946391.47506.yasmin_discussions_ntlab.gr@ntlab.gr>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Alyce
thanks for starting the discussion on science for the people
Science for the People: Radical Science for the 21st Century.
your post about the Dec 2017 Las ConCiencias conference ? "a call for
scientists to organize, to create new organizational systems for
aiding grassroots struggles? you say "gets to the heart of issues
around how to create a science that is truly by and for the people":
i have three related comments
a) as you know i have been advocating that we change 'science for the
people' to 'science for the people and planet" because the scientific
method is implicitly anthropocentric since humans conduct science (
there is an interesting literature on how the fact that humans are
symmetric animals has biased us towards the use of symmetry principles
in science and thus missing certain kinds of hypotheses)
b) in the last few years there has been a dramatic growth in
discoveries being made by AI/deep learning algorithms -there was a
recent editorial in science magazine which pointed out that the
scientists who use these AI systems cannot explain how the discovery
was made by the deep learning system, nor what hypotheses were tested
and discarded- so the software should be one of the co authors ( judge
john marshall has written about how this poses the problem of how
you interrogate software the same way you can interrogate the human on
what exactly they did so you can replicate it)
c) so yes -one of the issues for science for the people and planet in
the 21st century is the whole issue of how science is embedded in
society ( right now its conducted in ghettos called R and D labs or
also in ghettos called universities !) so yes the social embedding of
science needs to be redesigned as advocated by helga nowotny and
others, and the Las ConCiencias conference group is one issue.
but i think also the scientific method itself needs to be redesigned (
as it has always evolved over the centuries- newton would not
recognise current scientific methods !) not only to take into account
the AI issue i mentioned above, but also the development of the
sciences of complexity where emergent phenomena cannot be attributed
to simple cause and effect relationships using the kinds of equations
develped over the centuries ( eg you cant write an equation for
climate change, or your state of mind !)
if any yasminers attended Las ConCiencias conference it would be
great to hear from you !
roger malina in response to alyce santoros post below
the science for the people organisation just held a convention
https://scienceforthepeople.org/index.php/national-convention/
if you attended we encourage you to tell us about it
Alyce and Roger
Science for the People: Radical Science for the 21st Century.
roger malina
is in Dallas
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End of Yasmin_discussions Digest, Vol 4, Issue 3
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