Thank you very much for your thoughts and references I think the comment is
very interesting but specially appealing, meaning it has made me think
about the issue in a slightly different way...
It would seem to me both art and science might share a bit of colonial
spirit, I would say, in an organic form of speaking. Both are by definition
alien to nature itself, if we consider nature whatever alien to the human
being, as I would frame it if we use the very europcentric 19th century
history as reference point but also the very global/universocentric 21st as
current date for the discussion. I don't mean that's necessariously bad, I
would say indeed is good for science for art and for ourselves (public and
transducers in between) to practice recognition and acceptation.
On the other hand, one would say Beauty can be intrinsic to nature but we
can also point out its deeply related to art (both as motive and target)
but I would say also to science (both as motive (to understand) and target
(beautiful explanations as resolution to technical misterys)). Beauty both
in caos and order has moved humans to create art from the very begining,
beauty understood as anything caughting our eye and so our questions is
also in the very reason of science...
As for the "external world" I agree very much with what I think to
understand you express. Only I would say, and I think thats a mistake both
science and art have recently committed repeatedly, we are not able to
control it. I would say both A&S are impregnated by that present you
describe, maybe we are able to see it already, might be we'll realize in
some years time but anycase it is there by definition. As alien languages
to "Nature" our beloved AS are, they are, on the other hand, deeply related
to human "nature" which we should recognize is a fundamental part of the
first one ("Nature"). That's how our very artificial languages feed in
their origin with which they appear to fight often but is the only reason
for their true importance, to be a very powerful trans-temporo-spacial
communication tool. That's how I would accept years of going through, back
and for, similar topics and discussions, as "voyeurs" of that phenomenon we
can be a vital piece of it by the only effort of "being", participating,
taking place, arguing, cause the "importance" of the facts, events, pieces
or discoveries is long too far of our capacity but is in ourselves at the
same time.
Sorry about the disgression on a point you might have discussed before.
Sorry for my english.
Thank you because by appointing an "external" enemy you made me find so
many things A and S share.
Regards
Jc
---
----
2015-11-30 18:40 GMT+01:00 <kkursk@yahoo.com>:
> Paris 30 November 2015
> Dear Roger,
> I Trust all is well, and I thank you for your protean activity in Yasmin
> and around. Allow me to share a few thoughts with you that I have been
> chewing over the past few months and in particular after an interesting
> meeting in la Laboral in Gijon on the occasion of the opening of Materia
> Prima (
> http://www.laboralcentrodearte.org/en/exposiciones/materia-prima?set_language=en
> )
> In a nutshell the point is that, after following and participating for a
> number of years in the discussions in yasmin and many other fora that you
> know well and animate with great style and generosity, I have developed a
> few impressions:
> One is that the same arguments and ideas are repeated again and again in
> slightly modified formats, without much condensation, hypothesis testing,
> synthesis or advancement , in a sense rather perpetuating and enforcing the
> dichotomy A/S, as opposed to dis-inventing it and working towards a world
> where creative thinking (and creative thinkers, intellectuals if you want)
> cooperate and discuss to address, analyze in an active, astute, critical
> and intelligent manner the vast, social, political and environmental
> problems all societies are confronted with today.
> These problems are complicated and are seen differently form different
> positions in society and in different places in the world. The discussions
> (ie in Gijon a few weeks ago, etc) give the impression or are based on the
> shared assumption, that the A/S debate is eternal and universal, grouping
> all people in two internally homogenous groups: As and Ss, and an external
> population composed eventually of all non A and non S who are not
> considered. This configuration makes this environment progressively more
> autistic to the outside world where As and Ss and everybody else are
> fighting for their lives in a world progressively more violent, unfair and
> polluted that is at the same time endowed today with unbelievable
> competences, tools and power to face these problems in a cooperative and
> effective manner or, alternatively to amplify them.
> One line that might help us disentangle this in a logical way is the
> consideration that the A/S dichotomy has a history and an origin in a given
> period of time say 17 century and geographical location say Europe, it is
> there and then that this cognitive structure was put in place, propagated
> and perpetuated since, in parallel, simultaneously and organically together
> with the colonial effort and the domination and eventual destruction of any
> external agent.
> The A/S dichotomy is one central element of the us/them dichotomy at the
> base of hegemonic colonial domination, in consequence integrating these
> elements in a coherent critical analysis might help in moving on to a new
> set of practices and problems.
> I was reading this morning the paper of Koen Vermeir (Historicizing
> Culture,A Revaluation of Early Modern Science and Culture) a chapter for in
> a book in press (K. Chemla and Evelyn Fox-Keller (eds) 2016.Cultures
> without culturalism) preparing for a seminar at SAW (
> http://sawerc.hypotheses.org) next Thursday under the title Rethinking
> Practices and Cultures in the history of science, I thought the paper was
> quite consistent with the argument above and might be useful to work on it,
> and it contains a number of interesting references that might help us in
> working out operative proposals. I think you will find it interesting
> All the best, cordiallyr
>
> _______________________________________________
> Yasmin_discussions mailing list
> Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
> http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
>
> Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
>
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If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
Monday, November 30, 2015
[Yasmin_discussions] next move
Paris 30 November 2015
Dear Roger,
I Trust all is well, and I thank you for your protean activity in Yasmin and around. Allow me to share a few thoughts with you that I have been chewing over the past few months and in particular after an interesting meeting in la Laboral in Gijon on the occasion of the opening of Materia Prima (http://www.laboralcentrodearte.org/en/exposiciones/materia-prima?set_language=en)
In a nutshell the point is that, after following and participating for a number of years in the discussions in yasmin and many other fora that you know well and animate with great style and generosity, I have developed a few impressions:
One is that the same arguments and ideas are repeated again and again in slightly modified formats, without much condensation, hypothesis testing, synthesis or advancement , in a sense rather perpetuating and enforcing the dichotomy A/S, as opposed to dis-inventing it and working towards a world where creative thinking (and creative thinkers, intellectuals if you want) cooperate and discuss to address, analyze in an active, astute, critical and intelligent manner the vast, social, political and environmental problems all societies are confronted with today.
These problems are complicated and are seen differently form different positions in society and in different places in the world. The discussions (ie in Gijon a few weeks ago, etc) give the impression or are based on the shared assumption, that the A/S debate is eternal and universal, grouping all people in two internally homogenous groups: As and Ss, and an external population composed eventually of all non A and non S who are not considered. This configuration makes this environment progressively more autistic to the outside world where As and Ss and everybody else are fighting for their lives in a world progressively more violent, unfair and polluted that is at the same time endowed today with unbelievable competences, tools and power to face these problems in a cooperative and effective manner or, alternatively to amplify them.
One line that might help us disentangle this in a logical way is the consideration that the A/S dichotomy has a history and an origin in a given period of time say 17 century and geographical location say Europe, it is there and then that this cognitive structure was put in place, propagated and perpetuated since, in parallel, simultaneously and organically together with the colonial effort and the domination and eventual destruction of any external agent.
The A/S dichotomy is one central element of the us/them dichotomy at the base of hegemonic colonial domination, in consequence integrating these elements in a coherent critical analysis might help in moving on to a new set of practices and problems.
I was reading this morning the paper of Koen Vermeir (Historicizing Culture,A Revaluation of Early Modern Science and Culture) a chapter for in a book in press (K. Chemla and Evelyn Fox-Keller (eds) 2016.Cultures without culturalism) preparing for a seminar at SAW (http://sawerc.hypotheses.org) next Thursday under the title Rethinking Practices and Cultures in the history of science, I thought the paper was quite consistent with the argument above and might be useful to work on it, and it contains a number of interesting references that might help us in working out operative proposals. I think you will find it interesting
All the best, cordiallyr
_______________________________________________
Yasmin_discussions mailing list
Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
Dear Roger,
I Trust all is well, and I thank you for your protean activity in Yasmin and around. Allow me to share a few thoughts with you that I have been chewing over the past few months and in particular after an interesting meeting in la Laboral in Gijon on the occasion of the opening of Materia Prima (http://www.laboralcentrodearte.org/en/exposiciones/materia-prima?set_language=en)
In a nutshell the point is that, after following and participating for a number of years in the discussions in yasmin and many other fora that you know well and animate with great style and generosity, I have developed a few impressions:
One is that the same arguments and ideas are repeated again and again in slightly modified formats, without much condensation, hypothesis testing, synthesis or advancement , in a sense rather perpetuating and enforcing the dichotomy A/S, as opposed to dis-inventing it and working towards a world where creative thinking (and creative thinkers, intellectuals if you want) cooperate and discuss to address, analyze in an active, astute, critical and intelligent manner the vast, social, political and environmental problems all societies are confronted with today.
These problems are complicated and are seen differently form different positions in society and in different places in the world. The discussions (ie in Gijon a few weeks ago, etc) give the impression or are based on the shared assumption, that the A/S debate is eternal and universal, grouping all people in two internally homogenous groups: As and Ss, and an external population composed eventually of all non A and non S who are not considered. This configuration makes this environment progressively more autistic to the outside world where As and Ss and everybody else are fighting for their lives in a world progressively more violent, unfair and polluted that is at the same time endowed today with unbelievable competences, tools and power to face these problems in a cooperative and effective manner or, alternatively to amplify them.
One line that might help us disentangle this in a logical way is the consideration that the A/S dichotomy has a history and an origin in a given period of time say 17 century and geographical location say Europe, it is there and then that this cognitive structure was put in place, propagated and perpetuated since, in parallel, simultaneously and organically together with the colonial effort and the domination and eventual destruction of any external agent.
The A/S dichotomy is one central element of the us/them dichotomy at the base of hegemonic colonial domination, in consequence integrating these elements in a coherent critical analysis might help in moving on to a new set of practices and problems.
I was reading this morning the paper of Koen Vermeir (Historicizing Culture,A Revaluation of Early Modern Science and Culture) a chapter for in a book in press (K. Chemla and Evelyn Fox-Keller (eds) 2016.Cultures without culturalism) preparing for a seminar at SAW (http://sawerc.hypotheses.org) next Thursday under the title Rethinking Practices and Cultures in the history of science, I thought the paper was quite consistent with the argument above and might be useful to work on it, and it contains a number of interesting references that might help us in working out operative proposals. I think you will find it interesting
All the best, cordiallyr
_______________________________________________
Yasmin_discussions mailing list
Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
SBSCRIBE: click on the link to the list you wish to subscribe to. In the page that will appear ("info page"), enter e-mail address, name, and password in the fields found further down the page.
HOW TO UNSUBSCRIBE: on the info page, scroll all the way down and enter your e-mail address in the last field. Enter password if asked. Click on the unsubscribe button on the page that will appear ("options page").
TO ENABLE / DISABLE DIGEST MODE: in the options page, find the "Set Digest Mode" option and set it to either on or off.
If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
Sunday, November 29, 2015
[Yasmin_discussions] STEM. STEAM...STEAMS
Greg Paul Sheila
I think we need to advocate that there are multiple reasons for advocating
STEM to STEAM- and avoid oversimplifying- and that indeed we
want, in some cases not all, art and design better integrated into STEM
activities and also STEM better integrated into some not all
Art/Design/Humanities
programs
in a recent discussion with a journalist- the question was posed ' what jobs
are people trained in STEAM approaches being hired"
robert root bernstein replied : I'd say the question is misleading.
The purpose of STEM to STEAM is not to create some new hybrid
specialty, but to improve performance and creative ability in all of
the professions impacted by the integration.
I begged to differ- that the jobs argument is valid- but that we need
to buy into a rich variety of modivations
in the National Academy meeting in washington on next tuesday the
question is framed as:
· The value of incorporating curricula and experiences in the
humanities—including history, literature, language, philosophy,
religion, and the arts—into college and university STEM education and
workforce training programs, to understand whether and how these
experiences:...
· The value of incorporating more STEM curricula and experiences
into the academic programs of students who are majoring in the
humanities and related disciplines to understand whether and how the
career readiness of these students can be enhanced by exposing them to
deeper knowledge of science, engineering, medicine and technology...
· The benefits of creating opportunities and incentives for
incorporating the humanities into public policy deliberations around
the most compelling STEM issues of our day, such as global
stewardship, health care for our youngest and oldest citizens, and
gene editing.
(for the full statement see:
http://malina.diatrope.com/2015/11/26/grand-challenge-for-science-and-engineering-self-knowledge-an-open-call-to-humanists/
)
and insists on a call for a new humanism"
But it is a third, less instrumental justification for the humanities
in engineering education that will be most important for successfully
engaging the ultimate Grand Challenge of self-knowledge, that is, of
thinking reflectively and critically about the kind of world we wish
to design, construct, and inhabit in and through our technologies.
this is the concern about 'instrumental arguemnts' such as innovation
and entrepreneurship, attracting more people into STEM careers etc,
which should not occlude totally the fundamental reason why the
current disciplinary approaches are often lacking
but as i continue to say, lets not overgeneralise- there are very good
reasons to have narrow disciplinary experts for many many of the
problems that need to be solved
let me re iterate the invitation to all YASMINERS to tell us whats on
their mind- that has increased in importance over the past five years-
we will integrate these into the meetings over the next few months of
the SEAD network
roger malina
On Sun, Nov 29, 2015 at 4:12 PM, Greg Giannis <Greg.Giannis@vu.edu.au> wrote:
> Hi Paul
> Thanks for highlighting this. I am researching the teaching of code & hardware skills to artists and most of the literature around STEAM is as you say, very lopsided, harnessing the arts to get better engagement in STEM. But what about harnessing STEM creative types?
>
> Greg
>
>> On 30 Nov 2015, at 7:23 am, "Paul Fishwick" <metaphorz@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Since STEAM is on the table of discussion, this may be relevant - just posted it:
>>
>> http://creative-automata.com/2015/11/29/why-the-steam-argument-is-one-sided/
Full steam ahead. Or should I say STEAM ahead? STEM stands forScience,
Technology, Engineering, and Mathematics and has been a driving force
initiated by the National Science Foundation to focus education policy
within technical areas and their associated disciplines. More
recently, the letter "A" has been added to create a new movement
called STEAM. The "A" stands for the arts, and according to a leading
site devoted to STEAM, STEM + Art = STEAM. Since I spend much of my
time thinking about the interconnections between STEM and the Arts, I
welcome the STEAM movement. And yet, I have deep concerns about the
movement's three published policy goals stated on the STEAM site: (1)
transform research policy to place Art + Design at the center of STEM;
(2) encourage integration of Art + Design in K–20 education; and (3)
influence employers to hire artists and designers to drive innovation.
These are worthwhile goals, but notice how all three goals seem to be
about getting STEM-oriented folks to hire artists and designers, and
placing art & design at the middle of STEM? Let's flip this. What
about having STEM at the center of Art and Design? I am not suggesting
doing away with the three STEAM goals, but I am recommending some sort
of balance by extending or broadening these goals; the current ones
are lopsided. I strongly advocate new ways of starting with design and
the arts, and then surfacing STEM concepts from within art and design.
For the STEM subset of computing, this advocacy resulted in the
aesthetic computingmovement. Recently, this approach has taken root in
learning systems thinking in the art museum. I am not the first to
suggest this if we consider the larger literature base of blending
STEM with the Arts. Take Martin Kemp's book The Science of Art where
he explores mathematics and optics via art. Also, the MIT Press
Leonardo journals edited by Roger Malina has extensive historical
coverage of intersections of STEM and the arts. Leonardo was founded
in 1968, and so its publications contain a treasure trove of
knowledge, suggesting new ways to get to the heart of STEAM. To
advocates of STEAM, my suggestion is to rethink of STEAM as two-way
traffic: two steam locomotives, two tracks, perhaps with some switches
here and there.
>>
>>
>> Paul Fishwick, PhD
>> Chair, ACM SIGSIM
>> Distinguished University Chair of Arts, Technology, and Emerging Communication
>> Professor of Computer Science
>> Director, Creative Automata Laboratory
>> The University of Texas at Dallas
>> Arts & Technology
>> 800 West Campbell Road, AT10
>> Richardson, TX 75080-3021
>> Home: utdallas.edu/atec/fishwick
>> Blog 1: creative-automata.com
>> Blog 2: modelingforeveryone.com
>> LinkedIn: metaphorz
>> Twitter: @representationz
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Nov 29, 2015, at 10:12 AM, roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>> yasminers
>>> from sheila pinkel in california
>>> roger malina
>>>
>>> STEM, STEAM, STEAMS
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> By Sheila Pinkel, September 2015
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Due to poor U.S. student performance in the sciences, in 2006 the STEM
>>> concept for enhancing education in science, technology, engineering
>>> and mathematics was introduced in classrooms. (1). Beginning in 2012
>>> educators in Massachusetts, New Mexico and Rhode Island started
>>> experimenting with STEAM, adding art to the educational model. The
>>> chief objectives of the STEAM movement, according to RISD, were to
>>> "transform research policy to place art and design at the center of
>>> STEM" and "influence employers to hire artists and designers to drive
>>> innovation." Educators also said they wished to see art and design
>>> take a more central role in education, from kindergarten through
>>> college. (2)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I applaud these initiatives to enhance interdisciplinary learning.
>>> However, there is an important component still missing. Society, or
>>> STEAMS, needs to be added to create a complete educational model in
>>> which the history and social implications of science, social science
>>> and art are considered as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Historically there are very famous examples of the importance of
>>> understanding the social implications of scientific research. For
>>> instance, Leo Szilard, the first physicist to conceive of a chain
>>> reaction that could become an atomic bomb, in 1939 authored with
>>> Albert Einstein a letter to President Franklin Roosevelt expressing
>>> his concern about Germany making an a-bomb first. However, once the
>>> Manhattan Project had produced one, in the spring of1945 Szilard
>>> became concerned about consequences of using the a-bomb before an
>>> international control agreement had been discussed with the Soviets.
>>> After WWII Szilard founded the Council for a Livable World because he
>>> understood the importance of creating dialogue about the developments
>>> in science, especially as they relate to issues of war and peace.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Today it is important to consider the social implications of a
>>> worldview that has shifted from the domain of religion and philosophy
>>> to the sciences. Changing cosmological paradigms on the part of
>>> physicists because of rapidly changing knowledge about the macrocosm
>>> and microcosm in the universe has resulted in a master narrative about
>>> cosmological origins that is in constant flux. However, there is
>>> little commentary about this shifting construct of 'truth' and its
>>> affect on our lives and culture. As a result, when I asked may people
>>> about their thoughts about finally being able to 'see' the Higgs
>>> Boson, they said that it didn't matter to them because it has no
>>> impact on their lives.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In colleges and universities, the fragmented nature of an educational
>>> system in which the implications of economic paradigms or views of
>>> history are considered separately from the arts and sciences has led
>>> to a lack of dialogue about these inter relationships. Thus, often the
>>> human and social implications of the direction of research or works
>>> produced are absent and there is not a conceptual container to
>>> facilitate these discussions.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Some educational institutions have added social and/or
>>> multidimensional courses to their curriculum. For instance, Pitzer
>>> College, Claremont, CA., requires all students to spend a semester
>>> living and/or working with a local community to better understand the
>>> realities and dilemmas confronting the people in that community. Bryn
>>> Mar College, PA, offers three courses in one semester in which the
>>> same fifteen students look at a subject from various perspectives all
>>> semester. In the fall of 2015 the same students studied issues of
>>> incarceration in three classes, taught by a political science
>>> professor, social science professor, English professor and art
>>> professor.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> By adding 'society' to STEM and STEAM, the terrain for social,
>>> political, economic and/or historic discourse is available for an
>>> added dimension of dialogue and understanding to take place.
>>> Questioning the social implications of what we do can create clarity
>>> and help guide our life choices.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> (1) "Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics (STEM)
>>> Education: Background, Federal Policy and Legislative Action" (2008),
>>> Jeffrey J. Kuenzi, Congressional Research Service Reports, Paper 35,
>>> http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/crsdocs
>>>
>>> (2) "Gaining STEAM: Teaching Science though Art", US News NEWS: Eliza
>>> Krigman, Feb. 13, 2014.
>
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Yasmin_discussions] One-Sided STEAM Argument
Hi Paul
Thanks for highlighting this. I am researching the teaching of code & hardware skills to artists and most of the literature around STEAM is as you say, very lopsided, harnessing the arts to get better engagement in STEM. But what about harnessing STEM creative types?
Thanks for highlighting this. I am researching the teaching of code & hardware skills to artists and most of the literature around STEAM is as you say, very lopsided, harnessing the arts to get better engagement in STEM. But what about harnessing STEM creative types?
Greg
> On 30 Nov 2015, at 7:23 am, "Paul Fishwick" <metaphorz@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Since STEAM is on the table of discussion, this may be relevant - just posted it:
>
> http://creative-automata.com/2015/11/29/why-the-steam-argument-is-one-sided/
>
>
> Paul Fishwick, PhD
> Chair, ACM SIGSIM
> Distinguished University Chair of Arts, Technology, and Emerging Communication
> Professor of Computer Science
> Director, Creative Automata Laboratory
> The University of Texas at Dallas
> Arts & Technology
> 800 West Campbell Road, AT10
> Richardson, TX 75080-3021
> Home: utdallas.edu/atec/fishwick
> Blog 1: creative-automata.com
> Blog 2: modelingforeveryone.com
> LinkedIn: metaphorz
> Twitter: @representationz
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> On Nov 29, 2015, at 10:12 AM, roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>>
>> yasminers
>> from sheila pinkel in california
>> roger malina
>>
>> STEM, STEAM, STEAMS
>>
>>
>>
>> By Sheila Pinkel, September 2015
>>
>>
>>
>> Due to poor U.S. student performance in the sciences, in 2006 the STEM
>> concept for enhancing education in science, technology, engineering
>> and mathematics was introduced in classrooms. (1). Beginning in 2012
>> educators in Massachusetts, New Mexico and Rhode Island started
>> experimenting with STEAM, adding art to the educational model. The
>> chief objectives of the STEAM movement, according to RISD, were to
>> "transform research policy to place art and design at the center of
>> STEM" and "influence employers to hire artists and designers to drive
>> innovation." Educators also said they wished to see art and design
>> take a more central role in education, from kindergarten through
>> college. (2)
>>
>>
>>
>> I applaud these initiatives to enhance interdisciplinary learning.
>> However, there is an important component still missing. Society, or
>> STEAMS, needs to be added to create a complete educational model in
>> which the history and social implications of science, social science
>> and art are considered as well.
>>
>>
>>
>> Historically there are very famous examples of the importance of
>> understanding the social implications of scientific research. For
>> instance, Leo Szilard, the first physicist to conceive of a chain
>> reaction that could become an atomic bomb, in 1939 authored with
>> Albert Einstein a letter to President Franklin Roosevelt expressing
>> his concern about Germany making an a-bomb first. However, once the
>> Manhattan Project had produced one, in the spring of1945 Szilard
>> became concerned about consequences of using the a-bomb before an
>> international control agreement had been discussed with the Soviets.
>> After WWII Szilard founded the Council for a Livable World because he
>> understood the importance of creating dialogue about the developments
>> in science, especially as they relate to issues of war and peace.
>>
>>
>>
>> Today it is important to consider the social implications of a
>> worldview that has shifted from the domain of religion and philosophy
>> to the sciences. Changing cosmological paradigms on the part of
>> physicists because of rapidly changing knowledge about the macrocosm
>> and microcosm in the universe has resulted in a master narrative about
>> cosmological origins that is in constant flux. However, there is
>> little commentary about this shifting construct of 'truth' and its
>> affect on our lives and culture. As a result, when I asked may people
>> about their thoughts about finally being able to 'see' the Higgs
>> Boson, they said that it didn't matter to them because it has no
>> impact on their lives.
>>
>>
>>
>> In colleges and universities, the fragmented nature of an educational
>> system in which the implications of economic paradigms or views of
>> history are considered separately from the arts and sciences has led
>> to a lack of dialogue about these inter relationships. Thus, often the
>> human and social implications of the direction of research or works
>> produced are absent and there is not a conceptual container to
>> facilitate these discussions.
>>
>>
>>
>> Some educational institutions have added social and/or
>> multidimensional courses to their curriculum. For instance, Pitzer
>> College, Claremont, CA., requires all students to spend a semester
>> living and/or working with a local community to better understand the
>> realities and dilemmas confronting the people in that community. Bryn
>> Mar College, PA, offers three courses in one semester in which the
>> same fifteen students look at a subject from various perspectives all
>> semester. In the fall of 2015 the same students studied issues of
>> incarceration in three classes, taught by a political science
>> professor, social science professor, English professor and art
>> professor.
>>
>>
>>
>> By adding 'society' to STEM and STEAM, the terrain for social,
>> political, economic and/or historic discourse is available for an
>> added dimension of dialogue and understanding to take place.
>> Questioning the social implications of what we do can create clarity
>> and help guide our life choices.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> (1) "Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics (STEM)
>> Education: Background, Federal Policy and Legislative Action" (2008),
>> Jeffrey J. Kuenzi, Congressional Research Service Reports, Paper 35,
>> http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/crsdocs
>>
>> (2) "Gaining STEAM: Teaching Science though Art", US News NEWS: Eliza
>> Krigman, Feb. 13, 2014.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Yasmin_discussions mailing list
>> Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
>> http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
>>
>> Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
>>
>> SBSCRIBE: click on the link to the list you wish to subscribe to. In the page that will appear ("info page"), enter e-mail address, name, and password in the fields found further down the page.
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>> TO ENABLE / DISABLE DIGEST MODE: in the options page, find the "Set Digest Mode" option and set it to either on or off.
>> If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
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>
> Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
>
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[Yasmin_discussions] One-Sided STEAM Argument
Since STEAM is on the table of discussion, this may be relevant - just posted it:
http://creative-automata.com/2015/11/29/why-the-steam-argument-is-one-sided/
Paul Fishwick, PhD
Chair, ACM SIGSIM
Distinguished University Chair of Arts, Technology, and Emerging Communication
Professor of Computer Science
Director, Creative Automata Laboratory
The University of Texas at Dallas
Arts & Technology
800 West Campbell Road, AT10
Richardson, TX 75080-3021
Home: utdallas.edu/atec/fishwick
Blog 1: creative-automata.com
Blog 2: modelingforeveryone.com
LinkedIn: metaphorz
Twitter: @representationz
> On Nov 29, 2015, at 10:12 AM, roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>
> yasminers
> from sheila pinkel in california
> roger malina
>
> STEM, STEAM, STEAMS
>
>
>
> By Sheila Pinkel, September 2015
>
>
>
> Due to poor U.S. student performance in the sciences, in 2006 the STEM
> concept for enhancing education in science, technology, engineering
> and mathematics was introduced in classrooms. (1). Beginning in 2012
> educators in Massachusetts, New Mexico and Rhode Island started
> experimenting with STEAM, adding art to the educational model. The
> chief objectives of the STEAM movement, according to RISD, were to
> "transform research policy to place art and design at the center of
> STEM" and "influence employers to hire artists and designers to drive
> innovation." Educators also said they wished to see art and design
> take a more central role in education, from kindergarten through
> college. (2)
>
>
>
> I applaud these initiatives to enhance interdisciplinary learning.
> However, there is an important component still missing. Society, or
> STEAMS, needs to be added to create a complete educational model in
> which the history and social implications of science, social science
> and art are considered as well.
>
>
>
> Historically there are very famous examples of the importance of
> understanding the social implications of scientific research. For
> instance, Leo Szilard, the first physicist to conceive of a chain
> reaction that could become an atomic bomb, in 1939 authored with
> Albert Einstein a letter to President Franklin Roosevelt expressing
> his concern about Germany making an a-bomb first. However, once the
> Manhattan Project had produced one, in the spring of1945 Szilard
> became concerned about consequences of using the a-bomb before an
> international control agreement had been discussed with the Soviets.
> After WWII Szilard founded the Council for a Livable World because he
> understood the importance of creating dialogue about the developments
> in science, especially as they relate to issues of war and peace.
>
>
>
> Today it is important to consider the social implications of a
> worldview that has shifted from the domain of religion and philosophy
> to the sciences. Changing cosmological paradigms on the part of
> physicists because of rapidly changing knowledge about the macrocosm
> and microcosm in the universe has resulted in a master narrative about
> cosmological origins that is in constant flux. However, there is
> little commentary about this shifting construct of 'truth' and its
> affect on our lives and culture. As a result, when I asked may people
> about their thoughts about finally being able to 'see' the Higgs
> Boson, they said that it didn't matter to them because it has no
> impact on their lives.
>
>
>
> In colleges and universities, the fragmented nature of an educational
> system in which the implications of economic paradigms or views of
> history are considered separately from the arts and sciences has led
> to a lack of dialogue about these inter relationships. Thus, often the
> human and social implications of the direction of research or works
> produced are absent and there is not a conceptual container to
> facilitate these discussions.
>
>
>
> Some educational institutions have added social and/or
> multidimensional courses to their curriculum. For instance, Pitzer
> College, Claremont, CA., requires all students to spend a semester
> living and/or working with a local community to better understand the
> realities and dilemmas confronting the people in that community. Bryn
> Mar College, PA, offers three courses in one semester in which the
> same fifteen students look at a subject from various perspectives all
> semester. In the fall of 2015 the same students studied issues of
> incarceration in three classes, taught by a political science
> professor, social science professor, English professor and art
> professor.
>
>
>
> By adding 'society' to STEM and STEAM, the terrain for social,
> political, economic and/or historic discourse is available for an
> added dimension of dialogue and understanding to take place.
> Questioning the social implications of what we do can create clarity
> and help guide our life choices.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> (1) "Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics (STEM)
> Education: Background, Federal Policy and Legislative Action" (2008),
> Jeffrey J. Kuenzi, Congressional Research Service Reports, Paper 35,
> http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/crsdocs
>
> (2) "Gaining STEAM: Teaching Science though Art", US News NEWS: Eliza
> Krigman, Feb. 13, 2014.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Yasmin_discussions mailing list
> Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
> http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
>
> Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
>
> SBSCRIBE: click on the link to the list you wish to subscribe to. In the page that will appear ("info page"), enter e-mail address, name, and password in the fields found further down the page.
> HOW TO UNSUBSCRIBE: on the info page, scroll all the way down and enter your e-mail address in the last field. Enter password if asked. Click on the unsubscribe button on the page that will appear ("options page").
> TO ENABLE / DISABLE DIGEST MODE: in the options page, find the "Set Digest Mode" option and set it to either on or off.
> If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
_______________________________________________
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[Yasmin_discussions] input to SEAD Working Group at the National Academies in Washington, DC next February
yasminers
Luis Miguel Girao who is working the EC STARTS program sent in this
statement to our SEAD report 5 year update which is interesting to see
the discourse that is being used in different sectors
roger malina
"
The Commissioner of the European Commission for Research, Science and
Innovation, Carlos Moedas, in his official press conference of the ICT
2015 declared:
"I think that more and more we all understand that innovation in the
future will be on the intersection of arts and sciences."
http://ec.europa.eu/avservices/video/player.cfm?sitelang=en&ref=I110644
During the coming 5 years the European Union will ignite open
innovation all over its territory in a transversal manner throughout
disciplines in order to boost both the creation of new jobs and its
positioning as global leader. Horizon 2020 is the main instrument to
implement these activities. STARTS - the Science, Technology and the
Arts initiative of the Digital Agenda for Europe is the first match of
that ignition process. Within Horizon 2020 a first call for projects
was just launched to promote the integration of artists in research
teams on technology. The technological component is absolutely crucial
in all this process. Innovation in technology at the intersection of
the arts and sciences allows not only for the establishment of a
common ground of understanding between artists and scientist but more
importantly it is a privileged vehicule to concretely implement change
in societies and economies. In other words, the main idea is to go
beyond the published paper by delivering in research projects
prototypes, business models and start-up companies.
"
Best,
Luis
_______________________________________________
Yasmin_discussions mailing list
Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
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Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
SBSCRIBE: click on the link to the list you wish to subscribe to. In the page that will appear ("info page"), enter e-mail address, name, and password in the fields found further down the page.
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TO ENABLE / DISABLE DIGEST MODE: in the options page, find the "Set Digest Mode" option and set it to either on or off.
If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
Luis Miguel Girao who is working the EC STARTS program sent in this
statement to our SEAD report 5 year update which is interesting to see
the discourse that is being used in different sectors
roger malina
"
The Commissioner of the European Commission for Research, Science and
Innovation, Carlos Moedas, in his official press conference of the ICT
2015 declared:
"I think that more and more we all understand that innovation in the
future will be on the intersection of arts and sciences."
http://ec.europa.eu/avservices/video/player.cfm?sitelang=en&ref=I110644
During the coming 5 years the European Union will ignite open
innovation all over its territory in a transversal manner throughout
disciplines in order to boost both the creation of new jobs and its
positioning as global leader. Horizon 2020 is the main instrument to
implement these activities. STARTS - the Science, Technology and the
Arts initiative of the Digital Agenda for Europe is the first match of
that ignition process. Within Horizon 2020 a first call for projects
was just launched to promote the integration of artists in research
teams on technology. The technological component is absolutely crucial
in all this process. Innovation in technology at the intersection of
the arts and sciences allows not only for the establishment of a
common ground of understanding between artists and scientist but more
importantly it is a privileged vehicule to concretely implement change
in societies and economies. In other words, the main idea is to go
beyond the published paper by delivering in research projects
prototypes, business models and start-up companies.
"
Best,
Luis
_______________________________________________
Yasmin_discussions mailing list
Yasmin_discussions@estia.media.uoa.gr
http://estia.media.uoa.gr/mailman/listinfo/yasmin_discussions
Yasmin URL: http://www.media.uoa.gr/yasmin
SBSCRIBE: click on the link to the list you wish to subscribe to. In the page that will appear ("info page"), enter e-mail address, name, and password in the fields found further down the page.
HOW TO UNSUBSCRIBE: on the info page, scroll all the way down and enter your e-mail address in the last field. Enter password if asked. Click on the unsubscribe button on the page that will appear ("options page").
TO ENABLE / DISABLE DIGEST MODE: in the options page, find the "Set Digest Mode" option and set it to either on or off.
If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
[Yasmin_discussions] STEM, STEAM, STEAMS
yasminers
from sheila pinkel in california
roger malina
from sheila pinkel in california
roger malina
STEM, STEAM, STEAMS
By Sheila Pinkel, September 2015
Due to poor U.S. student performance in the sciences, in 2006 the STEM
concept for enhancing education in science, technology, engineering
and mathematics was introduced in classrooms. (1). Beginning in 2012
educators in Massachusetts, New Mexico and Rhode Island started
experimenting with STEAM, adding art to the educational model. The
chief objectives of the STEAM movement, according to RISD, were to
"transform research policy to place art and design at the center of
STEM" and "influence employers to hire artists and designers to drive
innovation." Educators also said they wished to see art and design
take a more central role in education, from kindergarten through
college. (2)
I applaud these initiatives to enhance interdisciplinary learning.
However, there is an important component still missing. Society, or
STEAMS, needs to be added to create a complete educational model in
which the history and social implications of science, social science
and art are considered as well.
Historically there are very famous examples of the importance of
understanding the social implications of scientific research. For
instance, Leo Szilard, the first physicist to conceive of a chain
reaction that could become an atomic bomb, in 1939 authored with
Albert Einstein a letter to President Franklin Roosevelt expressing
his concern about Germany making an a-bomb first. However, once the
Manhattan Project had produced one, in the spring of1945 Szilard
became concerned about consequences of using the a-bomb before an
international control agreement had been discussed with the Soviets.
After WWII Szilard founded the Council for a Livable World because he
understood the importance of creating dialogue about the developments
in science, especially as they relate to issues of war and peace.
Today it is important to consider the social implications of a
worldview that has shifted from the domain of religion and philosophy
to the sciences. Changing cosmological paradigms on the part of
physicists because of rapidly changing knowledge about the macrocosm
and microcosm in the universe has resulted in a master narrative about
cosmological origins that is in constant flux. However, there is
little commentary about this shifting construct of 'truth' and its
affect on our lives and culture. As a result, when I asked may people
about their thoughts about finally being able to 'see' the Higgs
Boson, they said that it didn't matter to them because it has no
impact on their lives.
In colleges and universities, the fragmented nature of an educational
system in which the implications of economic paradigms or views of
history are considered separately from the arts and sciences has led
to a lack of dialogue about these inter relationships. Thus, often the
human and social implications of the direction of research or works
produced are absent and there is not a conceptual container to
facilitate these discussions.
Some educational institutions have added social and/or
multidimensional courses to their curriculum. For instance, Pitzer
College, Claremont, CA., requires all students to spend a semester
living and/or working with a local community to better understand the
realities and dilemmas confronting the people in that community. Bryn
Mar College, PA, offers three courses in one semester in which the
same fifteen students look at a subject from various perspectives all
semester. In the fall of 2015 the same students studied issues of
incarceration in three classes, taught by a political science
professor, social science professor, English professor and art
professor.
By adding 'society' to STEM and STEAM, the terrain for social,
political, economic and/or historic discourse is available for an
added dimension of dialogue and understanding to take place.
Questioning the social implications of what we do can create clarity
and help guide our life choices.
(1) "Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics (STEM)
Education: Background, Federal Policy and Legislative Action" (2008),
Jeffrey J. Kuenzi, Congressional Research Service Reports, Paper 35,
http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/crsdocs
(2) "Gaining STEAM: Teaching Science though Art", US News NEWS: Eliza
Krigman, Feb. 13, 2014.
_______________________________________________
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If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
Saturday, November 28, 2015
Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Grand Challenge for Science and Engineering: Self-Knowledge- an open call to Humanists
I'd like to take part of your commentary below and provide my view.
I will include Mitcham's essay web link so that readers have something
easy to click:
I will include Mitcham's essay web link so that readers have something
easy to click:
http://issues.org/31-1/perspectives-the-true-grand-challenge-for-engineering-self-knowledge/
Your comment:
"These arguments are a relief beacuse many of us in the art/sci/tech
> community have despaired that ofen the arts and humanities are
> 'instrumentalised' with their being viewed as "in service' to the
> dominant technoscientific culture we are in- the mantra
> art/science/creativity/innovation/entreneurs/jobs/employment fails to
> ask the deeper question of what kind of world, and embedded values, do
> we want to build. The interaction of Science/Engineering with the
> Arts/Design/Humanities needs to be a symmetric process of mutual
> influence and mutual benefit and Mitcham articulates some of these
> arguments."
Please explain how you feel instrumentalized. From my perspective, it is the other
way around. Most in the arts and humanities are the ones doing the using, to the
point where the rich history and methods of mathematics, science, and engineering
disappear behind buzzwords like "technoscience." Note that Harold (who provides the
first comment to Mitcham's essay, at the end of it) provides a simple, yet practical,
response. I wonder how you might respond to Harold's concerns? I agree with you
that we should reflect upon the "kind of world" we want to build, but I'd say we are
doing that in our writing, and with our votes within a democracy. Mitcham's essay
will appeal to the already-converted, but I don't see anything substantial in answering
Harold's first question. What would Mitcham change? What courses should be added or
deleted?
I will close with a note on the definition of "human." As Petroski indicates by way of a
book title, "To engineer is human." The very idea of "human" is predicated on the
use of tools—bettering ourselves and evolving as a species because we learned
how to first use a stick. Critical reflection arrived on the scene much later (eastern
philosophy (e.g. China) and in the West (e.g., Greece). The disciplines that make
technology possible are mathematics and its progeny; the sciences and engineering.
I feel a blog post coming, but perhaps it is a bit premature until the dust has settled.
-paul
Paul Fishwick, PhD
Chair, ACM SIGSIM
Distinguished University Chair of Arts, Technology, and Emerging Communication
Professor of Computer Science
Director, Creative Automata Laboratory
The University of Texas at Dallas
Arts & Technology
800 West Campbell Road, AT10
Richardson, TX 75080-3021
Home: utdallas.edu/atec/fishwick
Blog 1: creative-automata.com
Blog 2: modelingforeveryone.com
LinkedIn: metaphorz
Twitter: @representationz
_______________________________________________
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Thursday, November 26, 2015
[Yasmin_discussions] Grand Challenge for Science and Engineering: Self-Knowledge- an open call to Humanists
Grand Challenge for Science and Engineering: Self-Knowledge- an open
call to Humanists
call to Humanists
Yasminers
On December 2, the US National Academy of Science is organising a
meeting to embark on new projects aimed at improving the understanding
and application of science, engineering and medicine toward the
social, economic and cultural well-being of the nation and planet. The
summary statement of scope is at
The announcement states: we believe it is critical to work with
partners in the humanities for their input and engagement.
This is an open call for all of us in the art/science/technology, STEM
to STEAM and other related movements to raise our interests, concerns
and issues !! We are currently doing a 5 year snapshot update of the
SEAD report and welcome your inputs:
https://seadnetwork.wordpress.com/ Yasminer posts that have been
appearing will be included in our complication.
Tom Rudin of the NAS, who is organising the Dec 2 meeting pointed us
to this excellent essay by Carl Mitcham:
http://issues.org/31-1/perspectives-the-true-grand-challenge-for-engineering-self-knowledge/
published in Issues, the journal of the NAS. He argues that we are
entering a new Axial Age:
"In a critical reflection on world history, the German philosopher
Karl Jaspers observed how in the first millennium BCE, human cultures
in Asia and Europe independently underwent a profound transformation
that he named the Axial Age. Thinkers as diverse as Confucius, Laozi,
Buddha, Socrates, and the Hebrew prophets began to ask what it means
to be human. Humans no longer simply accepted whatever ways of life
they were born into; they began to subject their cultures to critical
assessment. Today we are entering a new Axial Age, one in which we no
longer simply accept the physical world into which we are born. But
engineering makes almost no effort to give engineers—or any of the
rest of us—the tools to reflect on themselves and their
world-transforming enterprise."
These arguments are a relief beacuse many of us in the art/sci/tech
community have despaired that ofen the arts and humanities are
'instrumentalised' with their being viewed as "in service' to the
dominant technoscientific culture we are in- the mantra
art/science/creativity/innovation/entreneurs/jobs/employment fails to
ask the deeper question of what kind of world, and embedded values, do
we want to build. The interaction of Science/Engineering with the
Arts/Design/Humanities needs to be a symmetric process of mutual
influence and mutual benefit and Mitcham articulates some of these
arguments.
For the rest of this discussion- see my blog post at:
We welcome your comments and thoughts on this YASMIN discussion and
will include them in the synthesis we are preparing
Roger Malina
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Yasmin_discussions] why scientists engage in art-science practices
Dear Frieder
I would argue for a semantic reachability and cross-connectivity. An example
with black hole physics: I am reading through an article on dark matter or black
holes. Within each, I can scan the work of artists who use black holes as metaphors.
I can do this because I have a wiz-bang new human interface technology that is
being invented as we speak. If it doesn't yet exist, let's pretend. For those who are
interface-obsessed as I am, you might like a collection of futuristic interfaces I put
together on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLU7jB7dwlqS4MYL5pT_o248Soi1P2Vx1x
Indeed, I can browse the concepts of "hole" and "black." Change of venue: I am in
a museum. I am looking at an artist's work in abstraction expressionist style. There
is blackness. I reach out with my futuristic interface, and I can read the black hole
article in the museum. I swipe it and store it in my cloud reading folder for later
consumption. The problem is our lack of connectivity and that our human interfaces to
technology are very good, but not yet there. Let's see if we can work together
to improve them. I don't think any of this requires necessarily that artists and scientists
work together. Instead, let's work together at reaching each others products. Maybe
that is a start.
-p
I would argue for a semantic reachability and cross-connectivity. An example
with black hole physics: I am reading through an article on dark matter or black
holes. Within each, I can scan the work of artists who use black holes as metaphors.
I can do this because I have a wiz-bang new human interface technology that is
being invented as we speak. If it doesn't yet exist, let's pretend. For those who are
interface-obsessed as I am, you might like a collection of futuristic interfaces I put
together on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLU7jB7dwlqS4MYL5pT_o248Soi1P2Vx1x
Indeed, I can browse the concepts of "hole" and "black." Change of venue: I am in
a museum. I am looking at an artist's work in abstraction expressionist style. There
is blackness. I reach out with my futuristic interface, and I can read the black hole
article in the museum. I swipe it and store it in my cloud reading folder for later
consumption. The problem is our lack of connectivity and that our human interfaces to
technology are very good, but not yet there. Let's see if we can work together
to improve them. I don't think any of this requires necessarily that artists and scientists
work together. Instead, let's work together at reaching each others products. Maybe
that is a start.
-p
> On Nov 26, 2015, at 12:03 PM, roger malina <rmalina@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>
> Dear colleagues of Yasmin, engaged in exchanges about science and art
> or the other way around,
>
> with joy I read. Rubbing my eyes. A disbeliever often, a sceptic.
> The contributions, the discussion is inspiring. I wish I had time to
> participate in the way some of you do.
> But now the black holes, dark matter. And metaphors. This gives me a
> push to send a remark.
>
> A person trying to do a work of which she or he hope that it will be
> recognized as a work of art, often relies for many reasons on a
> metaphor, a metaphorical little story to find inspiration for that
> work. The black hole, of course, is such a case. A greatly powerful
> case. A strong mataphore. A hole, we immediately grasp. Likewise a
> hole when it is black.
>
> The physicist on the other side. I do not understand the physics of
> black holes nor all that that is associated with them. Even worse: I
> believe this metaphore when used in physics is as metaphorical as it
> would be in the case of a work meant to become a work of art. The
> black hole in physics is a work on its way to be accepted as a work of
> art. Unfortunately, the writing about it is lacking the artistic
> spirit. In the sense of art and science collaboration, two or a few
> more, from physics and from art, should get together and design a
> mutli-media event on black – not intending to demonstrate art in
> service of physics, but physics having become art.
>
> You believe this is not serious? Maybe you are right. I don't know.
>
> Frieder Nake
>
> _______________________________________________
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[Yasmin_discussions] he's done it again
Dear Yasminers,
I'll be damned if Frieder hasn't done it again! Where do art and
science really intersect? The black hole, of course!
And is it not akin to the "vanishing point" in Renaissance
perspective, into which all stories converge -- and from which all
stories emerge?
Regards
G. W. (Glenn) Smith
www.space-machines.com
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I'll be damned if Frieder hasn't done it again! Where do art and
science really intersect? The black hole, of course!
And is it not akin to the "vanishing point" in Renaissance
perspective, into which all stories converge -- and from which all
stories emerge?
Regards
G. W. (Glenn) Smith
www.space-machines.com
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[Yasmin_discussions] why scientists engage in art-science practices
Dear colleagues of Yasmin, engaged in exchanges about science and art
or the other way around,
or the other way around,
with joy I read. Rubbing my eyes. A disbeliever often, a sceptic.
The contributions, the discussion is inspiring. I wish I had time to
participate in the way some of you do.
But now the black holes, dark matter. And metaphors. This gives me a
push to send a remark.
A person trying to do a work of which she or he hope that it will be
recognized as a work of art, often relies for many reasons on a
metaphor, a metaphorical little story to find inspiration for that
work. The black hole, of course, is such a case. A greatly powerful
case. A strong mataphore. A hole, we immediately grasp. Likewise a
hole when it is black.
The physicist on the other side. I do not understand the physics of
black holes nor all that that is associated with them. Even worse: I
believe this metaphore when used in physics is as metaphorical as it
would be in the case of a work meant to become a work of art. The
black hole in physics is a work on its way to be accepted as a work of
art. Unfortunately, the writing about it is lacking the artistic
spirit. In the sense of art and science collaboration, two or a few
more, from physics and from art, should get together and design a
mutli-media event on black – not intending to demonstrate art in
service of physics, but physics having become art.
You believe this is not serious? Maybe you are right. I don't know.
Frieder Nake
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Monday, November 16, 2015
Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Greetings! with a quick response to your latest snapshot on neuroscience and art trends
Jon,
I´m reading the information, and it is very, very interesting. Here i leave
an article with a lot of information (in spanish), and some links to
science papers from Jeff Steinhauer
<http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v10/n11/full/nphys3104.html#auth-1>:
http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v10/n11/full/nphys3104.html
http://journals.aps.org/prd/abstract/10.1103/PhysRevD.92.024043
For my point of view, the real interesting think is this kind of metaphore
used, from black holes to dumb holes, has a tremeoundus richness. In my
point of view this kind of metaphores are enhanced in the art/sci typical
exchanges.
I don´t know if with this metaphores is possible to measure or to resolved
the problems from the real systems (black holes in this case), even may be
it is possible to obtain some nformation, but these are like physical
models. However, i´m sure that ths kind of creative thinking and modelling
has tremeodous impact to develop new concepts and new technologies. For
instance, they develope a lasing system with this kind of concepts.
It is a great example of the direct implications between theoretical
concepts, technoogies and disruptive thinking.
Thanks very much for your link Jon !!, i will use it in next art/sci
lectures.
Guillermo.
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Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Greetings! with a quick response to your latest snapshot on neuroscience and art trends
Hello Jon,
Yes, i agree that quantum mechanics is a great field to interact with
artists. For me is a passionate field, and may be one of the reasons
because i studied physics (even i´m not expert, or close to be an expert).
However, at the same time, is dangerous, in the sense that it is very easy
to go mystical or unnatural. In fact, in my impresion, i´m really excited
about this field because is natural (is nature¡¡) (but this is just
ideology, wich is transversal to any discussion).
Concerning Bell, i disagree with you. I think his famus paper is one of the
most cited in scientific literature (if not the most cited). At the same
time, John Bell has a tremendous reputation in science. I agree with you
about the richnes of his proposal. He make that somethinkg that was
considered as a problem if interpretation, become to a measurable problem.
I really like the problems of interpretation, and in quantum mechanics
there are a lot of interpretative arguments, but in science we finally want
to measure, and Bell did just this.
I´m reading your link with care (i´m far to be any kind of expert in this
field and i need time), but it seems fascinating, in the sense that they
use a beautifull metaphore (dumb holes), to study things that nowadays are
not easy/possible to measure. Thanks for the link, i will enjoy it !!, (i
think this is another example of the enrichment of science from artists: as
we are interested in many simillar phenomena, we can share information,
which comes from different sources)
Best,
Guillermo.
2015-11-16 11:11 GMT+01:00 Guillermo Muñoz <m.m.guillermo@gmail.com>:
> Hello Jon,
>
> Yes, i agree that quantum mechanics is a great field to interact with
> artists. For me is a passionate field, and may be one of the reasons
> because i studied physics. However, at the same time, is dangerous, in the
> sense that it is very easy to go mystical or unnatural. In fact, in my
> impresion, i´m really excited about this field because is natural (is
> nature¡¡).
>
> Concerning Bell, i disagree with you. I think his famus paper is one of
> the most cited in scientific literature (if not the most cited). At the
> same time, John Bell has a tremendous reputation in science. I agree with
> you about the richnes of his proposal. He make that somethinkg that was
> considered as a problem if interpretation, become to a measurable problem.
> I really like the problems of interpretation, and in quantum mechanics
> there are a lot of interpretative arguments, but in science we finally want
> to measure, and Bell did just this. Nowadays this is not possible to do it
> with string theories or with event horizonts, ..., so, let´s push to do it
> !!!
>
> Best,
>
> Guillermo.
>
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Sunday, November 15, 2015
Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Greetings! with a quick response to your latest snapshot on neuroscience and art trends
Ciao Guillermo,
I'm glad to hear about this conversation in Valencia. More than any other branch of science, I think quantum mechanics parallels so-called conceptual art in how a small effort can provoke a radical conclusion. I doubt most professional scientists appreciate the way Bell's theorem undermines our default view of the world. By contrast, string theory seems to require a vastly higher ratio of number-crunching to brain-scratching.
You might appreciate this recent related result, which blew my socks off:
"Quantum Entanglement Survives Across an Event Horizon"
http://ow.ly/3yrAv8
Physicist J. A. Wheeler famously said a black hole has no hair, meaning that all information about an object from the outside world dies once it enters a black hole. Now, apparently, a black hole can have hair if it's tangled.
jon
> On Nov 11, 2015, at 1:10 PM, Guillermo Muñoz <m.m.guillermo@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> I just come to home after having a really nice afternoon. I revised the new
> article from R. Hanson group about Bell inequalities violation without
> loopholes (detection and locality), published last 29 th October in Nature (
> http://hansonlab.tudelft.nl/loophole-free-bell-test/), with art students
> (within the framework of the art/sci subject in Visual Arts and Multimedia
> Master at Universidad Politecnica de Valencia. This was an example of
> really foundamental physics exchange for artistic pourposses/audience.
>
> Even to understand all the physics is not the objetive (i can not
> understand all the physics there, even i´m physicist), we made interestings
> paralelism about Duchamp work, and Goethe sentences, Poincare ideas of
> scientific research, fundations of quantum mechanics, semiconductor physics
> development, Nanostructured semiconductors, ...
>
> For sure, for me was very helpfull to find some time to learn and to study
> in detail some basic principles in physics that i didn´t recall at all (for
> example, the multipe interpretations of quantum mechanics or wave functions
> (psi-epistiemic vs psi-ontologic models)).
>
> We are trying to push new art students to collaborate with physisc and
> chemistry students, but this year we may have the posibility to include
> philosophy and history of science students. If we get it this would be
> great !!,
>
> Best,
>
> Guillermo.
> _______________________________________________
> Yasmin_discussions mailing list
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>
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Thursday, November 12, 2015
Re: [Yasmin_discussions] why scientists engage in art science practices
Hello Yasminers,
Yesterday evening we had one of our Art Sci Salon presentations
at the The Fields Institute for Research in Mathematical Sciences
in Toronto. http://www.artscisalon.com/ on the theme of
Revealing Neutrinos
with
Mark-David Hosale Digital Media, School of the Arts, Media,
Performance & Design, York University
and
James Madsen Physics, University of Wisconsin-River Falls
James and Mark David discussed their processes of collaboration
and the challenges in exploring the visualization and sonification
of data sets collected at the IceCube Neutrino Observatory.
After the meeting I have asked James Madsen why as scientist
is he engaged in art science collaboration? "I am deeply involved in
education and outreach - and find that in our ongoing
collaboration with Mark-David an artist who is well informed
in science and technology - we are able to explore and present
complex scientific concepts in a much more aesthetic and
accessible and way than I would through a science publication".
Please find below further info on the theme of the ArtSci event.
Nina Czegledy
IceCube Neutrino Observatory.
a new type of telescope made from one cubic kilometer of ice starting
one and half kilometers below the surface at the South Pole. Hosale
and Madsen have been working regularly with each other since 2012 and
have realized several projects including Quasar2 and 3, an
international art/science panel discussion at Deutsches Museum in
Munich, Germany, and a variety of education and outreach projects.
Their current work is the product of a collaboration between the
Wisconsin IceCube Particle Astrophysics Center and the nD::StudioLab
at York University.
>The Labs
>Wisconsin IceCube Particle Astrophysics Center (WIPAC)
>The Wisconsin IceCube Particle Astrophysics Center, or WIPAC
>(<http://wipac.wisc.edu>http://wipac.wisc.edu), is a scientific
>center within the Graduate School of the University of
>Wisconsin-Madison with faculty based in the Departments of Physics
>and Astronomy. Until December of 2011, WIPAC was known as the
>IceCube Research Center
>(<https://icecube.wisc.edu/>https://icecube.wisc.edu/). Following
>construction completion of the IceCube Neutrino Observatory in
>December 2010, the mission, vision, and name of the center were
>revised to reflect the shift from IceCube construction to data
>analysis and encompass a broader range of particle astrophysics
>research interests. The main goals of the center still revolve
>around IceCube: maintaining and operating the detector to maximize
>data output and supporting the international collaboration in
>multiple ways. Other priorities include recruiting and developing
>gifted researchers, developing a national education and outreach
>program, and contributing to the field of particle astrophysics.
>
> nD::StudioLab
>Led by Mark-David Hosale, the n-D::StudioLab
>(<http://www.ndstudiolab.com>http://www.ndstudiolab.com) is a
>multi-purpose facility designed for the research and development of
>transmodal artworks based on worldmaking theoretical research based
>at York University. The n-D::StudioLab is an adaptable space that
>can accommodate Research-creation activities that include
>theoretical discourse, methodological development, and the
>production of works. The common foci of these activities explore
>questions and produce work in the areas of ArtScience, Media Art,
>and Interactive Architecture. While a distinction between theory,
>methods, and making can be helpful for discussion, in practice they
>are interrelated with the output of one activity being the catalyst
>of another. Since its inception in October 2011 the n-D::StudioLab
>has been involved in the research and development of several works
>that have been shown internationally, and contributed to published
>research with a number of collaborators.
_______________________________________________
Yasmin_discussions mailing list
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TO ENABLE / DISABLE DIGEST MODE: in the options page, find the "Set Digest Mode" option and set it to either on or off.
If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
Yesterday evening we had one of our Art Sci Salon presentations
at the The Fields Institute for Research in Mathematical Sciences
in Toronto. http://www.artscisalon.com/ on the theme of
Revealing Neutrinos
with
Mark-David Hosale Digital Media, School of the Arts, Media,
Performance & Design, York University
and
James Madsen Physics, University of Wisconsin-River Falls
James and Mark David discussed their processes of collaboration
and the challenges in exploring the visualization and sonification
of data sets collected at the IceCube Neutrino Observatory.
After the meeting I have asked James Madsen why as scientist
is he engaged in art science collaboration? "I am deeply involved in
education and outreach - and find that in our ongoing
collaboration with Mark-David an artist who is well informed
in science and technology - we are able to explore and present
complex scientific concepts in a much more aesthetic and
accessible and way than I would through a science publication".
Please find below further info on the theme of the ArtSci event.
Nina Czegledy
IceCube Neutrino Observatory.
a new type of telescope made from one cubic kilometer of ice starting
one and half kilometers below the surface at the South Pole. Hosale
and Madsen have been working regularly with each other since 2012 and
have realized several projects including Quasar2 and 3, an
international art/science panel discussion at Deutsches Museum in
Munich, Germany, and a variety of education and outreach projects.
Their current work is the product of a collaboration between the
Wisconsin IceCube Particle Astrophysics Center and the nD::StudioLab
at York University.
>The Labs
>Wisconsin IceCube Particle Astrophysics Center (WIPAC)
>The Wisconsin IceCube Particle Astrophysics Center, or WIPAC
>(<http://wipac.wisc.edu>http://wipac.wisc.edu), is a scientific
>center within the Graduate School of the University of
>Wisconsin-Madison with faculty based in the Departments of Physics
>and Astronomy. Until December of 2011, WIPAC was known as the
>IceCube Research Center
>(<https://icecube.wisc.edu/>https://icecube.wisc.edu/). Following
>construction completion of the IceCube Neutrino Observatory in
>December 2010, the mission, vision, and name of the center were
>revised to reflect the shift from IceCube construction to data
>analysis and encompass a broader range of particle astrophysics
>research interests. The main goals of the center still revolve
>around IceCube: maintaining and operating the detector to maximize
>data output and supporting the international collaboration in
>multiple ways. Other priorities include recruiting and developing
>gifted researchers, developing a national education and outreach
>program, and contributing to the field of particle astrophysics.
>
> nD::StudioLab
>Led by Mark-David Hosale, the n-D::StudioLab
>(<http://www.ndstudiolab.com>http://www.ndstudiolab.com) is a
>multi-purpose facility designed for the research and development of
>transmodal artworks based on worldmaking theoretical research based
>at York University. The n-D::StudioLab is an adaptable space that
>can accommodate Research-creation activities that include
>theoretical discourse, methodological development, and the
>production of works. The common foci of these activities explore
>questions and produce work in the areas of ArtScience, Media Art,
>and Interactive Architecture. While a distinction between theory,
>methods, and making can be helpful for discussion, in practice they
>are interrelated with the output of one activity being the catalyst
>of another. Since its inception in October 2011 the n-D::StudioLab
>has been involved in the research and development of several works
>that have been shown internationally, and contributed to published
>research with a number of collaborators.
_______________________________________________
Yasmin_discussions mailing list
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If you prefer to read the posts on a blog go to http://yasminlist.blogspot.com/
Wednesday, November 11, 2015
Re: [Yasmin_discussions] Greetings! with a quick response to your latest snapshot on neuroscience and art trends
Hello all,
I just come to home after having a really nice afternoon. I revised the new
article from R. Hanson group about Bell inequalities violation without
loopholes (detection and locality), published last 29 th October in Nature (
http://hansonlab.tudelft.nl/loophole-free-bell-test/), with art students
(within the framework of the art/sci subject in Visual Arts and Multimedia
Master at Universidad Politecnica de Valencia. This was an example of
really foundamental physics exchange for artistic pourposses/audience.
Even to understand all the physics is not the objetive (i can not
understand all the physics there, even i´m physicist), we made interestings
paralelism about Duchamp work, and Goethe sentences, Poincare ideas of
scientific research, fundations of quantum mechanics, semiconductor physics
development, Nanostructured semiconductors, ...
For sure, for me was very helpfull to find some time to learn and to study
in detail some basic principles in physics that i didn´t recall at all (for
example, the multipe interpretations of quantum mechanics or wave functions
(psi-epistiemic vs psi-ontologic models)).
We are trying to push new art students to collaborate with physisc and
chemistry students, but this year we may have the posibility to include
philosophy and history of science students. If we get it this would be
great !!,
Best,
Guillermo.
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Tuesday, November 10, 2015
Re: [Yasmin_discussions] latest snapshot on neuroscience and art trends
On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 1:51 PM, toddsiler1 . <siler.todd@gmail.com<mailto:siler.todd@gmail.com>> wrote:
I agree with Greg Dunn's point that 'many artists who use scientific methods
in their work are not recognized as being "science artists" (such as Georges
Seurat and John Singer Sargent), yet the inclusion of them under a broader
umbrella term may help to educate the public about the pervasiveness of
scientific observation in artistic practice.'
The referencing of an artist such as Seurat in this discussion brings to mind other issues surrounding the lineage between current art-science and earlier developments in late nineteenth and early twentieth-century art — a relationship that I believe is under-acknowledged in general, and then somewhat erroneously attributed when it is acknowledged.
Although an artist like Seurat was engaged with explorations in optical and visual perception, and the Cubists may somehow have been reacting to Einstein's theory of relativity, what science such artists were (or may have been) illustrating or exploring in their work is not the most salient antecedent to current art-science. I think there is a much more profound relationship between the two eras — i.e., what was going on in the late nineteen-hundreds with the general notion of how humans perceive space, and how pictorial space in the visual arts enshrined in the human psyche certain assumptions and particular world views.
When modern art changed from expressions located in pictorial imaginary space, to expressions located in physical real space (think, from Cezanne to Malevich and Duchamp), it was superficially described as being a transition from representation to abstraction — and that is the difference which became understood and studied as the era's paradigmatic change.
But I think maybe the paradigmatic change was actually in space-orientation, and what makes this a distinction with a difference, rather than without one, is the recognition that pictorial illusionistic space is what had embodied and validated imaginary, erroneous, and so-called supernatural beliefs about the world for millennia prior to the nineteenth century. The dismantling of pictorial illusionistic space by artists of that century and its replacement with the aesthetics of real space (the canvas as an object in our real world rather than a window through which we peered into an imaginary one) exalted and gave existential priority to the space science studies rather than the space where persistent mythologies thrive. Science and art have propelled this gradual paradigm change over the last century-and-half, and its primary effect continues to be an erosion (albeit slow) of belief in the so-called supernatural with a concomitant rise in the aesthetic embrace of, and concern for, the natural.
Today that vector of change is manifest in the art-science movement, and should be part of any discourse over the movement's emerging meanings. I have written some about this in an essay for the 2014 exhibition REALSPACE, at http://bit.ly/1MJHlxr .
Stephen Nowlin
S t e p h e n N o w l i n
Vice President
Director, Alyce de Roulet Williamson Gallery
ArtCenter
1700 Lida Street
Pasadena, CA 91103
626.396.2397 | http://williamsongallery.net/google
[cid:4D2FFFF7-41DB-405E-AA69-B6C08178ECB5]
P a s a d e n a — C I t y o f A r t & S c I e n c e
I agree with Greg Dunn's point that 'many artists who use scientific methods
in their work are not recognized as being "science artists" (such as Georges
Seurat and John Singer Sargent), yet the inclusion of them under a broader
umbrella term may help to educate the public about the pervasiveness of
scientific observation in artistic practice.'
The referencing of an artist such as Seurat in this discussion brings to mind other issues surrounding the lineage between current art-science and earlier developments in late nineteenth and early twentieth-century art — a relationship that I believe is under-acknowledged in general, and then somewhat erroneously attributed when it is acknowledged.
Although an artist like Seurat was engaged with explorations in optical and visual perception, and the Cubists may somehow have been reacting to Einstein's theory of relativity, what science such artists were (or may have been) illustrating or exploring in their work is not the most salient antecedent to current art-science. I think there is a much more profound relationship between the two eras — i.e., what was going on in the late nineteen-hundreds with the general notion of how humans perceive space, and how pictorial space in the visual arts enshrined in the human psyche certain assumptions and particular world views.
When modern art changed from expressions located in pictorial imaginary space, to expressions located in physical real space (think, from Cezanne to Malevich and Duchamp), it was superficially described as being a transition from representation to abstraction — and that is the difference which became understood and studied as the era's paradigmatic change.
But I think maybe the paradigmatic change was actually in space-orientation, and what makes this a distinction with a difference, rather than without one, is the recognition that pictorial illusionistic space is what had embodied and validated imaginary, erroneous, and so-called supernatural beliefs about the world for millennia prior to the nineteenth century. The dismantling of pictorial illusionistic space by artists of that century and its replacement with the aesthetics of real space (the canvas as an object in our real world rather than a window through which we peered into an imaginary one) exalted and gave existential priority to the space science studies rather than the space where persistent mythologies thrive. Science and art have propelled this gradual paradigm change over the last century-and-half, and its primary effect continues to be an erosion (albeit slow) of belief in the so-called supernatural with a concomitant rise in the aesthetic embrace of, and concern for, the natural.
Today that vector of change is manifest in the art-science movement, and should be part of any discourse over the movement's emerging meanings. I have written some about this in an essay for the 2014 exhibition REALSPACE, at http://bit.ly/1MJHlxr .
Stephen Nowlin
S t e p h e n N o w l i n
Vice President
Director, Alyce de Roulet Williamson Gallery
ArtCenter
1700 Lida Street
Pasadena, CA 91103
626.396.2397 | http://williamsongallery.net/google
[cid:4D2FFFF7-41DB-405E-AA69-B6C08178ECB5]
P a s a d e n a — C I t y o f A r t & S c I e n c e
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